Samsung hasn't actually stuck with the same formula vs the S4 (kitchen sink analogy).
If anything, they've dropped features one by one, all in the name of advancing tech, w/the replacement not always being an improvement.

All the while, with the price creep into the $1000+ range for the entry level flagship & it's small wonder sales have plunged......

This may sound like a broken record, but, people do like removable batteries/I-R Blasters/3.5mm audio jack/LED notification. An argument could be made for capacitive navigation buttons, but, I think Samsung has a fair & reasonable solution w/their take on gesture navigation.

Bottom line, build a top spec phone with all the features listed above in the mid-range & flagship segments & sales will explode.

Yes people like those things.

I never understood people's need for IR blasters in a phone. I've never used the 3.5mm jack on my S10e, but I can understand its necessity. Although I was a supporter of removable batteries, in the last 4 years or so I never felt the need to swap the battery out until it started failing (after 1.5-2yrs).
The LED notification - now THIS is really needed.

What's also needed is size choice - the only reason I chose the S10e is its size. There are others phones I'd have bought had they been smaller (I'm looking at you, OnePlus). I hate the current phablet trend.

And lastly (and I'm probably in a minority) - I wish they kept the home/back/task manager buttons.

The I-R Blaster, perhaps not so much a need, but, nice to have, especially for those who don't have a WI-FI network in their homes. It's just a nice convenience to have on a phone.

I've heard the rationale for various reasons why feature "X" is obsolete, if that is applied across the board, you could strip a phone down to its core function, the dialer & nothing else.

BTW, count me in the same camp as you, I'd like to see a return to capacitive buttons, along with flatter displays & a modest increase in side bezels, just enough to prevent accidental screen touches.
While we're at it, let's ditch the glass on the backside for a durable material that will allow for wireless charging.

I'm not using it either, but if people still like it, there should be an option. If not from Samsung, then someone else could cover that, as LG does with (great) audio jack.

And I'm on your track with smaller devices...didn't buy s10e because of weak battery, didn't buy One+8 because of a size and all the compromises made, so I don't believe it's worth a price.

In my opinion, Samsung biggest fail this year is (beside pricing), not introducing s20e model.
A device with screen and physical size of S10e, 2mm thicker, but with larger battery and new SoC.
Everything else can be the same...even the camera.
Yes, I would like better night photos, but it would bring the costs up.

But than, s10e was least selling device of s10 bunch...
So, yours and mine wishes are not in Samsung's interest.

They are trying to sell underperforming A line instead for higher prices.
Yes, A50 is good device, but even A51 can't be used as my s8 replacement.
A70 neater....maybe for some people that like bigger screens that device is ok, but it is slower than 3 years old flagship....and it can't be un-noticed

You know, if they had put a 3.5mm jack socket in the A90 then there would have been a SD865 option for EMEA and I could see that being preferable to the Exynos curse of the S-class in the region. I bought a 1+6T and passed it on because it does not fit my lifestyle. The A90 (or S10 lite) with 3.5mm jack socket would have satisfied my needs

Price.... 1575 Euro for the S20 Ultra 512gb...
Sorry but that is a NO from me, and I have had Notes since the Note 2.
I don't mind paying but I do mind getting robbed

I think the Ultra is aimed at a small percentage of the population who want the absolute best at whatever cost, like the previous Porshe Design phones from Huawei. In my opinion we should judge it with that in mind. Whether the sum of its parts deserves that price is arguable, however not relevant for that particular phone if you ask me.

Samsung focused on everything but, the camera set up/sensors/software... Epic mess and even with the update still having auto adjust issues.

My opinion on flagship phones have drastically changed in the last year. Ever since the days of the G1 I've always ran a flagship from either HTC in the early years, and then Samsung and LG. Last year I downgraded to an A70 to see if I truly needed to shell out for the S10 and I was pleasantly surprised. After that phone took an unexpected trip between a car tire and pavement, I cheaped out an bought a Moto G7 plus to hold me over till my next "flagship". It was the Moto that made me realize a good phone can be had for under 500$ (275$ CAD in my case). It does everything I need, has great battery and it is unlocked. Is it perfect? Nope. Do i miss features from a flagship? Absolutely. But it's also a 1/4 of the cost, and I'm not tied to an individual carrier. But as someone who has shifted priorities in what I need out of a mobile as I age, spending big bucks on a flagship is just not "worth it" to me. Mid-range phones are starting to have great shooters and stellar battery and now I'd rather put that money saved into a better laptop, headphones or subscription to whiskey of the month club. Will I ever get a flagship again? Maybe...but it sure better come at a good price to be "worth it", and the S line just doesnt fit that bill for me anymore.

100% agree. I have an A50 and I absolutely love it for the price. Came from a 4year old s6 edge and it's definitely an upgrade. It even has a headphone jack which I love because I use the same headphones I use for gaming with my phone and I don't need to buy another pair just to use my phone for music via shity Bluetooth

Nice to hear that you're settling down. Not everyone needs a Porsche :)

Maybe it's important to also shed some light on the watered down offerings Samsung is offering outside of the US. The Exynos variants of the latest flagships not only come with poorer screen calibration but also in many cases with lesser RAM and even without 5G. With frequent throttling, over heating and battery drain the Exynos variant also sports an embarrassingly incompetent 4G modem, to hit the nail on the coffin the Exynos variant is also facing unique bugs (green tint/black pixelation). It's clear that Samsung is interested in prioritizing their bottom line over globally unified consolidation. In typical dense fashion Samsung has yet again managed to disappoint many users that have supported the brand for a while. I for one, shall be spending my money elsewhere the next time around. I do hope Samsung takes this empirical drop in consumer interest as a blaring caution that it's time to change how they're running their business. At least if they'd like to reposses their dusty throne.

$1400. Yes, a similar iPhone costs just $50 less and is technically inferior, but only Apple can get away with that kind of price. Instead of undercutting Apple on price with a superior phone, Samsung is merely matching them...and then regrettably failing in the basics, like photo processing and processor performance (Exynos).
I'm thinking about what a Note 20 will bring to the table over my Note 10+, and I don't see much; especially when you KNOW Samsung will charge north of $1400 for it.
Sorry, Samsung, but yearly $1500 upgrades is just dumb.

Apple shouldn't get away with it.

I own the iPhone 11 Pro Max and the GS20 Ultra as my business phone. The Ultra has been specs on paper but those means NOTHING in the real world. My iPhone is faster, gets better battery life, has better cameras for pics and videos, and it's cheaper. The 100 times zoom takes pics that look like trash and the auto focus is broken so the camera struggles to take close up pics or videos that aren't blurry or out of focus. Samsung is the best at marketing ginmick features but this year those gimmicks don't add up to $1,400 or the best phone.

I'm sorry, but how is the iPhone faster? Everyone I have seen has said the Samsung feels faster due to its high refresh rate screen.

There is a video that compares the new software update camera fix(loose fix) on S20 ultra vs IPhone 11 pro max... Guess what still takes better photos and auto focuses without issue... The iPhone 11 pro max. Samsung only corrected the software slightly but, still sufferers camera auto focusing.

Samsung doesn't want you to pay $1500 yearly. Even of you did, you're an idiot because they have a buyback program with giving you up to $800 for your "old" phone. But if you consider your tech old after a year and need un upgrade, that's you and I recommend to consult a psychiatrist because you have an issue with compulsive material shopping.

I don’t think the S line is failing. Across the board smartphone sales are down and with the economy tanking sales won’t improve for some time. Smartphones in general probably aren’t high on the priority list for people.

I bought an s20 ultra and like it, but it doesn’t have any standout feature or wow factor. The camera was rough in the beginning and it has only gotten a little better. I’m sure reports of the ultra’s camera not being super great also cut into sales.

In general there wasn’t anything that compelling for buyers to latch on to with the s20 line. It’s pretty much just okay at everything and has a high price.

Yeah it has a high refresh rate, but not at the highest resolution, and battery tanks because of it. Yeah the camera can do 100x but the photos at that zoom are worthless.

It’s kind of just a meh upgrade all around this year. Maybe now Samsung will have to innovate more and the low sales of the s20 can be the motivation they need.

Samsung are innovating with the Fold. A phone/tablet hybrid is everything I want. It's probably gonna take a few more years before it's affordable and all the issues have been sorted out but as with the Galaxy Note from years back, Samsung are innovating.

I bought an S9.
I bought an S10+.
I can't see myself buying another Galaxy S because they have removed the headphone jack socket and that is something I need from my smartphone.
I realise that many have learnt to do without, but I do not choose to do so.
I may buy another 'flagship' level phone ot just 'settle' for a model with lower specification that does have a headphone socket.
The S10+ will do fine for now.

I got an s20 plus and it comes with headphones you plug into the USB port. So not as if you can't use wired headphones.. Just not standard 3.5mm jack. I find it a pain but still a good phone.. The ultra is pathetic for the price. My s20 plus is £49 a month while the galaxy s9 plus contract that ended was £47 month... Lol.. Just gotta wipe the old s6 and s4 phone and sell it (I always keep a spare on a different network just in case of emergency )

Sure, but I have a lot of wired headphones. Those dongles stop you charging and listening at the same time. But, you know what? It's doing me a favour really, can't spend money on expensive phones if they don't have 3.5mm socket...

...look at this Xiaomi Redmi K30 5G Racing that was just released. Has a 3.5mmm jack socket. The processor is pretty quick.

I have a Note 10 + and don't miss the headphone jack as the AKG branded earbuds that come with it are plenty for casual listening and if I want better I can always hook up my FiiO E18 and use my Audio Technica ATH-m50x's that way or snag a plethora of Bluetooth amps/dacs if I want to go wireless with them instead. FiiO has a line that range from like $20 up to like $100+ give or take some cash. I personally update my android phone every 2-3 years and before the Note 10+ it was the S8 since it was during the whole Note 7 fiasco and before the Note 8 was out to replace it. Had a Note 4 and a Note 3 before that personally. There was no way I was going for the Note 5 NOT with its lack of SD card which is needed for me since I use it to hold my roms/disc images for emulation. Also I carry around some FLAC files and those are quite LARGE as well

That's fine if that's how it works for you, but my preference is for wired headphones or earphones. Thankfully some devices are still available with headphone jack sockets and midrange processors are pretty good these days. I will probably go for a Pixel 4a, well '5a' or '6a' if they have sockets. No need to change yet.

One, actually 2 things more to charge regularly...no thanks.

What are you going to do when all phones phase out the headphone jack, because it is happening. Even cheaper phones have started phasing it out.

It is difficult, I think I'll just live one day at a time. Who knows, maybe there will be a resurgence, like there was with vinyl, eh?

Still, don't worry about me. It will be a while yet and I can use the phones I (will) have until they die.

Good news! They just released the Poco F2 Pro with a headphone jack socket for €499. Are you happy for me? 🥳

Well... We are going through a recession on the verge of a depression.. A phone starting at 1000 is not on the top of most people's priorities now. Also, the smartphone market has been declining for a while now, add that with these new s20 phones aren't bringing anything truely ground breaking compared to the s10 as far as the average consumer is concerned and you have low sales.

people are holding onto their phones longer because there's not much of a reason to even upgrade every 2 years unless you're in one of those upgrade programs imo

I heard that there was some kind of pandemic going on. A pandemic where almost every retailer on the planet is losing money. Seems like I heard it somewhere.

I've said this elsewhere; I'm willing to pay if I see value for the money. The S20 series does not deliver value.

Reasons why I see no value:

1) there is no headphone jack; so buying one would require replacing headphones and a speaker. It's not just the cost of the phone, it's also the cost of those accessories that would need replaced too.

2) 5G - it's still limited on where I could use it. It's available where I work, but not where I live or where I spend weekends. I'm not paying a premium to upgrade to a radio tech that likely won't be available widely enough for a few years yet - by which time, I would likely be moving up to a new device anyway. 5G is simply not a selling point for me (yet). I was also burned by buying an early 4G device - never again. On the 4G transition, the telecom industry taught me not buy early devices using new radio tech.

3) I have an S10+, and the incremental improvements in phones today don't justify annual upgrades anymore. A new device should last me a minimum of two years; although I'll likely hold onto the S10+ closer to three years unless there's a new "wow" feature added to newer devices.

Samsung needs to take this time to refocus on value to the customer, and actually listen to customer feedback. They need to ask themselves hard questions about past changes that failed to deliver value. And they need to rethink their strategy going forward. I doubt they have the backbone to do that, but I hope I am wrong.

They'll certainly never put the headphone jack back in, and they'll definitely start to phase it out of their cheaper devices over time. Once headphone makers start to adopt USBC I think high audio quality wired headphones will make a comeback. Although I'm sure they'll wait for the iPhone to finally jump to USBC before switching out the audio jack.

let's face facts:
1. the Galaxy S is no longer the mainstream flagship device,
2. the Galaxy Note is no longer the high-end niche (halo) device, &
3. there are 3-4 globally available low-end to mid-level Samsung smartphones that offer 90% of what both the S & Note devices offers.

today, the S & Note phones are very similar in appearance & capabilities. the new foldable devices are the new (halo) & defacto flagship offerings based on public perceptions. and in today's market, the newest gimmick leads the trends. so now the new pecking order is:

Fold 1
Z Flip
Note 20
S20
A
M
J
etc....

The S line of devices aren't on top anymore & so aren't the (trendiest) most wanted devices anymore. it would benefit Samsung if the reduced pricing for the Fold & Z-Flip and made more available from ALL major US carriers.

Just bring back the headphone jack and I won't mind that ugly rear camera setup, then I'll spend my hard earned money on it!

There is no point in buying a flagship for over a $1000. I got the LG G8 which is a flagship phone with the head phone jack still and a quad DAC for $275 new 2 months ago.

There are plenty consumers who enjoy the presence of a headphone jack and it was a feature that never should have been deleted. These manufacturers are tone deaf to what the consumers want, jack up the prices for gimmicky features the vast majority are not interested in and then complain about plunging sales.

apple showed OEMs (despite Essential doing it first) that removing the headphone jack, then making proprietary headphones and dongles was more profitable than leaving them in
everyone except LG, and a few others hopped on board, but thankfully most mid rangers still keep it
which I find ironic since a useful tool is now seen as a "budget" option outside of LG

Yeah the LG is definitely great if you're into music. I bought an LG V30 just to use as a music player, not even connected to a cell provider. That said, I bought the S20 Ultra for $760. The G8 doesn't compare to speed, screen res, camera, 5G, battery, to the S20, and only just now got android 10. But yeah, a bargain for $275 bucks if not a refurb, since it retails for $850.

Some say Samsung's customer support isn't great, but my experience is LG's is worse. I have a LG smart 60" TV, with the cursor remote that failed. CS never did return emails or phone calls. Cost me $100 plus shipping for a new remote. Since tech support wouldn't talk to me, I had to guess that was the problem. Fortunately it was. But was forced to gamble with a 100 dollar non-returnable item.

I can just say one thing, you're lucky that you didn't buy Samsung TV.
On 3 years old flagship, there is no Apple TV+ app, no Disney app support...wireless connection is just terrible, so often happens that you can hear but not see the picture within Netflix and Amazon video...and no help. Well...I should return it within one year, but since I live in middle ow newer and I should actually send it to them....I would be at least a month without a TV.
So...

Why are you using Apple TV and Disney+ in the first place?

Why not?
I

They suck

Why is there no point?

this is really good from a consumer standpoint, it forces them to try a different strategy who knows maybe they gonna merge the Note and S line in the future, anyway smartphones has become wayyy too expensive for what they offer, im not saying Samsung and them are giving us crap iets just innovation seems at a stand still

Agreed, adding that they became too big as well, too fragile (glass back, curved edges, punchhole/notch), too dumb (removed features with the notable exception of gaming phones).

Most of the companies dont care about their older customers and dont provide good support.Most people dont upgrade devices every year so software support matters to them and samsung is one of the worst in terms of software support, They keep doing great work with their latest generation but dont care about people who will hold on to last year's phone. I think apple still has a good reputation due to their excellent software experience.

With the situation of economic depression worldwide that the coronavirus has caused, Samsung is going to have lousy sales. A cell phone at $1400 is just way high. The Apple 12 Pro Max will have the same size and characteristics for $400 less, which will result in better sales. Sorry for my affirmation but Samsung got to a point to be too greedy for their flagships. It got to assume the consequences.