Disqus - Latest Comments for MichaelCline

Re: Save Your Family Money With an Annual Delta Companion Ticket

Mike Cline — Tue, 02 Jul 2019 16:42:49 -0000

My wife and I each have the platinum card and until this year, have never had any issues finding flights to use it for. But now, it seems as if the available fights are much more restrictive, making it less of a perk, and more of a hassle. If I take a random flight just to use it, or have to transfer it to someone else before it runs out, then what's the point? Delta or Amex (whoever is pulling the strings) has gotten so greedy and so restrictive. Shocking from an airline company, I know.

Re: How To Create A Custom Facebook Profile Frame + 3 Free Templates

Mike Cline — Fri, 23 Mar 2018 17:28:23 -0000

I"m having the same issue.
I also can't get the frame to actually show up on the post where you can supposedly share it to the word out. I can add a picture, but the frame disappears.

Re: Churches Can’t Trunk or Treat Their Way to Health

Mike Cline — Tue, 02 Jan 2018 16:10:51 -0000

I dig the deconstruction. Now let's do some construction.

What would be an alternative, to say something like VBS? Something that would connect to families in the community, but actually result in people connecting to the church afterwards and not just hoping from VBS to VBS every summer?

Is it all just about followup or can we brainstorm some events/ideas that would be a better alternative?

Re: The Most Important Meeting of Your Year

Mike Cline — Mon, 08 May 2017 14:14:11 -0000

come back to this year after year. Thanks for such a great article David.

Re: Tim Keller under the Eye

Mike Cline — Wed, 04 Jan 2017 00:54:26 -0000

you don't think there is evidence that Jesus existed?

Re: Measuring Church Health: How many people will serve?

Mike Cline — Wed, 30 Nov 2016 17:48:16 -0000

So someone who serves once every 6 weeks or so would not be factored in right? Only if they serve consistently, or once a month?

Re: Measuring Church Health: How many people will serve?

Mike Cline — Tue, 29 Nov 2016 12:29:40 -0000

Is a volunteer included in this number if they serve a certain amount of times? For example, is a volunteer who serves in the nursery as a "fill-in", as needed basis included in the count alongside someone who serves weekly? Just curious as to how that would affect the metrics.

Consistent, plugged-in volunteers are surely different when it comes to the impact of your ministry and the growth in their own life, right?

Re: Teach About Jesus with The Legend Of The Candy Cane

Mike Cline — Tue, 29 Nov 2016 12:01:01 -0000

Do you have this printable still? The link is broken :(

Re: Memorial 351

Mike Cline — Mon, 06 Jun 2016 12:39:18 -0000

I've always thought this idea makes sense, but would be a headache for local churches and districts to continually adjust their giving and receiving amounts. However, the point to the district that this is how local churches operate (by faith, year to year, month to month), is well put. And there seems to be more evidence in this proposal of it working in one of our districts (North Michigan). I'd like to hear more about why it has worked logistically, and why it was NOT recommended. I'm sure there are great reasons, would just love to hear them. It's been discussed before, but I think it's time for us to visit it again. Would love someone from the floor to ask for this to be read or we will never hear the reasoning.

Re: Memorial 355

Mike Cline — Mon, 06 Jun 2016 12:34:50 -0000

This, combined with the incremental step down in USF over the next 5 years is a blessing. Thank you. Let's get it done delegates!

Re: 10 Myths About Large Churches – OutreachMagazine.com

Mike Cline — Mon, 01 Jun 2015 18:32:25 -0000

I would be really interested in seeing the research and numbers behind the idea that large churches are actually "feeder" churches to smaller congregations. As well as the idea that megachurches do not primarily grow through transfer growth. Can anyone point me to some hard data on that? Of course it's a both/and. But I'd like to see the numbers. I think I remember reading in Everyday Church by Tim Chester and Steve Timmis the exact opposite -- that large churches ARE like Walmart.

In my experience, many larger churches start small...hit a window of explosive growth that is largely fueled by "transfers"...and then go on to grow by conversions and de-churched attendees. That's all anecdotal though. Anyone got any solid numbers?

Re: FYI Playlist: 25 Free Resources for Transition Season

Mike Cline — Tue, 06 May 2014 19:00:43 -0000

I've done a small group for grads throughout the summer the past two years using the Sticky Faith material. But I thought I would switch it up this year and condense it into a 3 day retreat, still using some of the sticky faith curriculum as well as some other videos/discussion guides.

Re: FYI Playlist: 25 Free Resources for Transition Season

Mike Cline — Tue, 06 May 2014 18:44:14 -0000

This is great stuff. I've bookmarked several to use with my seniors at our "Grad Getaway" in June. Pumped to have you here in Salem, Oregon in a couple of weeks Brad.

Re: 10 Simple Practices to Help You Experience Your Future Dreams

Mike Cline — Wed, 04 Dec 2013 14:16:21 -0000

All of these sound great. But how does one graduate without debt, while slaving away at an minimum wage or unpaid internship instead of working a job?

And "getting a real job" when you graduate is precisely the problem many Millennials are having in this economy. I think it's a great list, but easier to read and post on your bathroom mirror than make happen.

Re: Recent Cascade HS grad seriously hurt in crash

Mike Cline — Fri, 07 Jun 2013 21:11:07 -0000

Past tense language makes it sound as if the girl is already deceased. Not so.
Keep fighting Lindsey as we lift you up to the Lord of all comfort and hope.

Re: 25 Reasons I’m Not Getting a PhD Right Now

Mike Cline — Wed, 28 Nov 2012 18:55:20 -0000

I wanted to do a PhD a few years ago, but now I just don't have the stomach for it. Most of my reasons are similar to yours, though I've got a little less deprecating humor pointed towards the egg heads in our midst. :)

Let me add two to list, both that sum up several of your own:
(1) Because I'm a white male, and most grad schools and Evangelical-ish programs are in haste to catch up to the rest of the academic world by hiring minorities. I've seen acadmic posts left open for a couple of years, with tons of good resumes thrown in the trash, waiting for that perfect minority candidate.

(2) Because I don't like being taken advantage of, which is what schools do routinely to adjunct professors.

Re: Being a Dad… that Walks the Family Talk

Mike Cline — Fri, 27 Jul 2012 12:49:04 -0000

"Instead, they thought he was foolish. They thought that he had a duty
to the denomination. They thought he made a mistake. I’ve talked to
several since then that question his decision, even flippantly, because
he, as they say, could have done “so much more for God” had he been in
that position than he has done since."

Anyone who thinks as much should read your other recent posts on denominational work. Because, you know, you can do "so much more for God" working at headquarters than anywhere else in the kingdom. Rubbish!

Re: Right and Ruthless

Mike Cline — Tue, 24 Jul 2012 18:25:46 -0000

I share many of your concerns about what we mean when we trumpet the term "leadership." I'm not into the pastor-as-CEO model. But the bottom line is: As Maxwell would say, "leadership is influence." As pastors, we influence people, either positively or negatively, for the kingdom of God. I think Kevin is just encouraging pastors and the institutions of TWC to step up their game and be more fruitful in God.

I also wonder how many of the interns who go through a program like this would purposefully choose to pastor small, rural churches when they are done. You make a lot of good points and raise a lot of tough questions in that regard.

But I wonder, what did Kevin say that primarily "comes from a mega-church model?" Is there anything about his ideas and challenge that doesn't apply to smaller churches (which, as you point out, makes up the majority of the denomination)?

Re: Memorial 52 and the Body

Mike Cline — Wed, 18 Jul 2012 13:44:22 -0000

Though I don't necessarily agree with his portrayal of the holiness movement, I think this is what Richard Foster is trying to get at in his "Stream of Living Water"

Re: Memorial 52 and the Body

Mike Cline — Wed, 18 Jul 2012 13:43:36 -0000

I love this: "In essence, submitting to a Wesleyan Ecclesiology is agreeing to submit to the Wesleyan expression of the Orthodox Christian faith."

I guess the next question is what is uniquely Wesleyan? And how do we express that? It's a tension between offering our unique voice and distinctives to the wider catholic Church, while also making sure we don't major on the minors, or allow a strict "bounded set" of Wesleyan ideals to ghettoize us from the larger orthodox "centered set"

Re: Memorial 52 and the Body

Mike Cline — Wed, 18 Jul 2012 13:10:18 -0000

An ecclesiology that gives preference to the authority of the individual over the authority of a collective body (be it the local church, the district, or the denomination on the whole) is predominantly what I've witnessed in TWC. Which, when taken to it's extremes, is not only a highly individualistic eccleiology, but I would argue is really no ecclesiology at all. It's modernity's grasp infiltrating our denomination. You see it not only in this debate about Memorial #52, but in a very strong movement within the denomination to "go back to the Bible" with membership commitments, church governance, gender roles, etc. What those people fail to realize is that they aren't going back to some pristine understanding of the Bible; they are simply elevating their own individual reading of the Bible against others and calling it "the biblical" way to do things.

But this is the Protestant curse, is it not? Who gets to say what the Bible says? Many would argue that collective voices like a denomination are there to answer this question, but when we live in a culture that refuses the authority of anything above the "I," they will hold no weight.

We have to turn to some tradition. All of our readings our "traditioned" (which many scholars have demonstrated, and introduced and championed in our stream by Ken Schenck). The question is really what tradition will get the trump card. Will it be the solo tradition of my conscience, my reasoning, my experiences, my library...or will we search for a tradition larger than ourselves, listen to it, add to it, and then submit to it? And again, the question is not whether we will submit to a tradition and an authority, but which one (Alisdair McIntyre, et al). Any talk of a peculiar Wesleyan ecclesiology or Wesleyan hermeneutic is a moot point if the people reject from the start the idea that they are traditioned.

As I see it right now, the de facto is blind individualism, and the de jure is invisible or unexplained.

Re: Denominational Fences

Mike Cline — Thu, 12 Jul 2012 19:05:32 -0000

I've had this conversation with many people, many times. I want to reiterate that I will submit to TWC's current position on this issue and that I think you CAN make a theological case for abstention (love of neighbor, wise stewardship, fruit of self-control, etc). But I still think the position needs to be changed, and I actually think it's arguments like this one that convince me that it needs changed.

You articulate very clearly that drinking alcohol -- and going futher, being addicted to alcohol -- is not a black and white issue. "Addiction" is a sliding scale and includes a lot of contextual factors to be taken into consideration. Furthermore, your comment about "any type of drug" reminds us that absolutely anything can turn into an idol or an addiction.

Which is exactly why it makes no sense to hold to such a black and white ruling on this issue. Our current policy renders something black and white that is in fact gray. And why take such a hard line about Coors Light and not McDonalds, Facebook, romance novels, or a host of other things you can become addicted to? Why not instead replace the singling out of one issue with a more broad statement that includes addictions of any kind?

For modeling responsibility, let me give this a stab -- drinking a glass of wine with good friends at a bbq in your backyard is responsible. Drinking 4 drinks every day is not. Just because we can't clearly draw a line doesn't mean we can't use good judgment and common sense. That argument just doesn't hold any weight with me.

Re: Coming Up – Announcement about SoulShift Family Ministry Kit

Mike Cline — Wed, 11 Jul 2012 07:23:59 -0000

Thanks to "the Matts" and WPH for this great resource. I tried to adapt
the SoulShift book for our youth when our church experienced the
series. I'm sure this will be much better. Excited to get my hands on a
copy.

Re: Denominational Fences

Mike Cline — Tue, 10 Jul 2012 13:55:31 -0000

So here's my attempt. Hopefully this will break the ice and get things going a bit:

(1) I haven't been around TWC for very long (8-9years). So I haven't seen the major shifts that others probably have. The biggest example I can think of is the addition of community membership, and what that has meant for our ecclesiology and local church polity. Also, the shifting of several items that used to be lifestyle membership commitments into a less enforced category of "special directions." I'm not sure what led to these fences bending. For community membership, there was a lot of pressure from larger churches in our denomination and from church plants who were struggling to get anyone in their congregations to sign on the dotted line for covenant membership with the drinking prohibition. Other special direction updates were likely caused by wider cultural shifts (ex: "Social dancing isn't that big a deal anymore")

(2) Big "fences" to be battled over in the future -- #1 The continued push to normalize social drinking, #2 Church planting vs church renewal (where will our focus, and therefore our resources, be prioritized and why?), #3 Homosexuality...enough said. And #4 A growing divide across our denomination that for lack of better categories I'll call "fundamentalism vs progressives." There will be many fences examined in that arena (biblical interpretation, use of social sciences, a shift in ecclesiology, etc)

(3) I'll throw my name out there as one person who would like to see the alcohol fence come off the books. I've written entire papers arguing FOR the prohibition stance, so I'm not just some hipster that wants to sip wine with my cool neighbors. I think there were legitimate historical and cultural reasons for this fence to be constructed when it was. Plain and simple, our country was full of drunkards who beat their wives and children. We're not talking Coors Light here; more like moonshine and whiskey. But a lot has changed since then and I think it's time we acknowledge that. (Though again, I think there are legitimate reasons for prohibition, both personally and theologically).

(4) As of now, I can't think of any fences we need to reinforce, though conversations about homosexuality needs to start happening on a wider level in our denomination, and not just whether or not we should support policies like DOMA.

Re: Denominational Fences

Mike Cline — Tue, 10 Jul 2012 13:54:10 -0000

One reason I wrote this post was because often times I'm led to believe that young pastors are the real "trouble-makers" in the denomination. It's the under-40 clergy that want to blow the system up, tear down the fences, deconstruct the denominational polity, etc. And while I do have my days of being jaded and looking for a good fight, I'd like to think that many of us youngins are much more nuanced than that.

And if we're not, then shame on us! Before we go tearing things down, we need to have some quality conversation with those around us and those who have come before us about WHY particular policies, practices, and beliefs have been codified and passed on. I wrote this post hoping we could do just that.