DISQUS

Alice - good post.

Large wine distrib sales rep - agreed that there is room for all size distributors, and that large distrib's are more than occasionally demonized, which is unfair to the reps who really do right by their customers, show up, are attentive, listen, and actually know about wine. Having met many reps working for the likes of Southern, Charmer, etc, I can say that reps who possess all these traits at one of these huge companies are few and far between. Not to mention that the scale which a large distrib enjoys allows them to offer what seem like compelling deals, from wine list printout to closeout pricing on wine which they bought huge quantites of and couldn't sell.

Somm's, GM's and restaurant owners (not to mention retailers!) really ought to keep in mind that the deals they think they are always getting from these guys are more than occasionally for product which is mediocre at best, either due to the quality of the wine to begin with, the terrible storage conditions, etc.

LRA went to making recipe wines beginning when? Yes, Pecina used to work there so wouldn't there exist the possibility of smearing the former employer? That having been said, while the '00 Ardanza tastes great the '01 Alberdi was not as much to my liking as Alberdi usually is - and in the really strong '01 vintage!

Hmm....

Oh well, all these new wine bars and restaurants can't be winners, I suppose. Further, I'd say that the flashier places, with the fancy buildouts in excess of $1M and the prime locations, overwhelmingly tend to underwhelm and deliver minimal value, as well as offer very little in the way of a warm, friendly atmosphere. All style, no substance, if you will. I'm glad that you were able to salvage the evening at C24.

Ryan - I hear that 1975 Poujeaux Moulis-en-Medoc is very tasty Bdx. I had their '78 and it still was amazingly fresh and vibrant. Surprisingly youthful and high-toned fruit.

Cheers,
Joe

Ryan -

You're ever the generous and patient host to still share a glass with this 'strawman' who writes such poorly written, and misunderstood articles for his poor 'small town' readers, and then gets all bent out of shape when he is taken to task for writing a poor, misleading article. Geez, this guy is more sensitive to criticism than the Man of Monkton.

David, I'm new to wine blogging and relatively new to this site, but I am pretty confident that most folks outside of the self congratulatory crowd you speak of would read your article and be confused as to what Spanish wines are about. Maybe your talents would best be served writing for the trade pubs you previously mentioned and not for newspapers or consumer publications.

And that's it from me on this thread.

Feliz y prospero ano nuevo, Ryan. Looking forward to what you've got in store for '08 on catavino.

-Joe

David,

Thanks for clarifying and providing the history above. What I was trying to point out in my critique of your article, is that old vines and low production are not necessarily indicative of poor quality wine. Which, to me any, is what your article suggested. Your article also seemed out of step with the way that a lot of people view Spanish wine these days. Therefore many people on this site, myself included, thought it worthwhile to point this fact out to you. Including one of catavino's founder, Ryan Opaz, who originally offered his critical opinion of your findings. I do not pretend to speak authoritatively on the Spanish wine industry, which is why I consult this website and others like it to increase my knowledge.

David - I regret that you consider tough, constructive criticism an 'ad hominem attack.' And I regret that all of this needed to happen on what is typically a very civil, informative blog.

True, Constellation won't destroy the little guys. And their brands get a lot of folks into wine. I mean how many folks out there can point to Manischevitz as their first sip of alcohol?

I don't think I'd be too surprised to hear which wineries use mainly new French oak, micro-ox, and others because with some experience these are techniques which can readily be identified in wine. As for mechanical harvesting for 'old guard' estates, no surprises there. Especially in Rioja, I'd imagine.

Oh, and I don't doubt that LRA, LdH and Fernandez have benefitted from new techniques and equipment in the winery. But they certainly are not using 100% new French oak, using reverse osmosis, micro-ox or anything like that, either. They are of the old guard, but make authentic, excellent, typical wines of their region. And I did not feel that the author had mentioned that these types of wineries exist in Spain.

Good point on the vines. Of course, old vines do not equal good vines. But old vines do necessarily mean that they are worthless and need to be replanted, either. Look at Toro, Jumilla, Barossa, Lodi, and many other regions producing good wines from 50+year old vines.

I would downgrade Red Guitar from 'very good' to 'ok.' Just my opinion....

Constellation is reponsible for these 'fine wine' wineries: Hogue, Escudo Rojo, Ravenswood, Kim Crawford. Bad - maybe not. Boring, safe and branded - absolutely.

Constellation also markets an assortment of cheap booze such as Arbor Mist, Paul Masson and Almaden. I don't trust a company who is pushing these types of drinks to produce and market fine wine.

Ryan,

The press certainly does drive sales by talking about wine, but presently, many more boxes of wine are sold in the US market if they are pointed either by Parker or the Wine Spectator. The ratio of customers who approach me asking for that Spanish wine which was 94 pts Parker and $30, or in the Spectator Top 100, versus customers who were reading about an exciting newly popular region in Spain and would like to try one of their wines, is still about 5-1.

Didn't mean to exclude your blog in my comment. Will add you to my links, and thanks for adding me as well!

Best,
Joe

I'm all for vinous exploration. And I'm all for not whining in most cases.

An exception would be when it comes to pointing out the fact (or whining) that a lot of wines from all over the world taste awfully similar. Wineries are rewarded by much of the press for producing these cookie cutter wines. And the press drives the market, not the other way around. Let me repeat that statement: THE PRESS DRIVES THE MARKET. As anyone who works for a wholesaler or especially a retail shop will attest, many customers want wines with points. So I will happily read, and tell others to read, blogs from people like Alice Feiring, Manuel Camblor and Lyle Fass, to name a few, because their viewpoint is so staunchly independent of, and radically different from, most of the wine media. Yes their opinions are strong, and they may come across as whiney, overly geeky and didactic at times, but I can live with that. As long as I'm enjoying myself and learning something, I'll keep on reading.

So, I say, long live the wine whining! Now if only I read French, so that I could check out that new Noisettier book....

What a misinformed article. Some of the more noticeable, misguided (and misguiding) statements:

"It’s a crowd-pleaser produced by wine giant Constellation Brands, which rarely makes market missteps."

[Constellation Brands and huge beverage companies like them produce and market largely homogenous, bad wines. Almost anyone in the wine business will concur]

"Spain is very much two different wine industries: the old, low-production, shaky quality industry and the cutting-edge next generation that replanted vines and invested in the new equipment and techniques."

[Many Spanish wine drinkers would take issue with this declaration. Where would the author place La Rioja Alta, Lopez de Heredia, and Bodegas Alejandro Fernandez? Also to associate low producing vines with poor quality wine is wrong. As many people know, older, lower yielding vines produce less, but tastier fruit. And to tie the 'cutting edge next generation' with what is good is not correct either. Ask anyone who tastes Spanish wines every week, sees the amount of new importers cropping up in the states, and is unable to differentiate between various wines from Toro, Montsant etc.]

A few questions I would ask the author, who works in one of the worst states to buy wine in the country (possibly second only to Alaska?): Why not write about wines that are available in neighboring states such as Maryland and New Jersey? Why assume that your readers only drink wine a few times a month and want a dumbed down explanation of exciting, new types of wine? How often are you, as an advocate of the joys of drinking wine, voicing your disapproval of the current, un-democratic, unfair state control of wine and liquor in Pennsylvania?

Not to be cruel or mean spirited, but I would suggest that any lover of wine who lives in the Wilkes Barre, PA area supplement their local weekly wine column with Eric Asimov (New York Times), or even Dorothy and John Brecher (Wall St Journal), a few obviously more experienced, more skillful wine writers.