DISQUS

i has luvs

Thanks Sam...we'll see what we can come up with. Video has actually been available through ShareASale and many other networks as well for many years... just in my opinion not "friendly" enough for a lot of merchants and affiliates alike.

Our hope with the feedback will be to get some idea how far people would like the network to carry the technology...i.e., to what point can we go where the merchant and affiliate will feel more comfortable using it.

Good find Scott - and the comparison is very good. Over the years we have seen some pretty deceptive practices being called "creative marketing" at times. In a world where conversion doesn't matter...all the ads have to do is makes someone click.

I tried to dig up an old speech I gave a few years ago, cause I had pictures of some good examples similar to what you have... but couldn't find it... the premise though was about deceptive ads and some examples... off the top of my head I remember:


"Click here you are a winner"

"Your computer may be infected with a virus, click here"

Ads that are designed to look exactly like a Windows System popup, where the "X" in the top right corner doesn't close the ad, but instead clicks through to an ad.

These ads tend to find their way onto popuplar sites like "Lyrics", "music downloads".... things where the amount of traffic is very high - but where better marketing methods such as Affiliate Marketing do not work very well due to the intention of the user (come to site, get lyric, leave)... So these sites often use Ad Networks to monetize - leaving the Advertiser to try to come up with ways to increase click thru count.

I found a few examples just by browsing around - but didn't want to post them here didn't know if you wanted them - so posted on my blog you can take a look if you want. If you browse around on sites like the ones that I mentioned above though, you'll see plenty of your own examples.... and not suprisingly they are served very often by the same 2 Ad networks...

Anyhow - I agree with you - both Google and Reunion.com should be way above this... considering Google already has a "deceptive ad" policy for PPC ads.

Jim,

My comment wasn't really about which network, etc... just in general, what the network has to do with a merchant that has a bad policy, etc...

It was my understanding that this wasn't a network thing - that the merchant made the choice to decline/remove, etc...

Shouldn't the focus be on how to improve the merchant, or educate... as opposed to what the network did or didn't do, etc... ?

Jim - What does this have to do with the network?


Shawn - good post, Agreed on the overall theme... merchants should understand that this is a long term project and investment... Michael Coley actually has a really good post up on ABW about what to do with inactive affiliate that could further the education here if you want to link to it.

Congrats to everyone invloved, especially Andy with a great win for a great cause.

Vinny,

Congrats on the deal and the announcement. :)

Yes - very important to learn the commands. :)

I learned the "leave" and "off" quickly as often times conversations go on between two or three people, etc... It is fun to watch, but my phone battery can't hold up!

Just as important, is for the Twitterererers to make sure to direct one way communications via the Direct Message where possible. Twitter only has this from the web interface right now but surely there is a command coming soon?!


Other things I would like to see....

1. Groups
2. (I second the choice for...) Zap :)

The experiment continues!

Carsten,

(I posted this earlier but seems it didn’t make it…)

I think you are making assumptions that you probably shouldn’t in this case.

As with ALL merchant checkout choices, the merchant needs to make sure that measures are in place to track transactions. This is no different from phone orders, PayPal, check payments, etc… We always work with all our clients on each one of these just as we do with Google Checkout to make sure that tracking continues to work.

As with any issue, if a merchant doesn’t consider the affect on a shopping cart change, etc… there isn’t much we can do until we notice. On account of the fact that Google Checkout is gaining such popularity with Merchants - we are reviewing the entire merchant base and notifying those using G of the potential problem, and how to fix it. Many of our current base have already spoken to us when considering implementation of G which we have worked with them on as well.

I've been told by 3 seperate "CPA network"s that they can't do RevShare % deals. I was not told in any of the three conversations whether this was a "technical" problem, or a "by management decision"... so I think at least a little of that sentiment is coming directly from the CPA networks and not necessarily bad assumptions.

The word "can't" was specifically used 3 different times. I remember, as it struck me as an odd word to use each time.

Actually - I have to follow up on my own response. :) haha

Regarding JellyFish - I can see whey and how they would need different tools from networks... (Hey look, I just signed up, "Geek Marketing" works !)

"Affiliate Networks" get a lot of their leverage by providing a "basic" set of tools, to the masses... However, without speaking for every "network", I think it is safe to say that in specific situations the network has had to provide something a "little different" for a specific advertiser, or a specific affiliate. I know that we have - and I think this is where we will agree that a network needs to be flexible.

Are your advertisers being told that they "cannot do certain things", or are they not asking?

Quoting from Jeff:

1) Flexible payment options for (different kinds of) affiliates (who bring different kinds of visitors)

2) Affiliate networks don’t bring unique (unattainable in other ways) affiliates - advertisers must work to go get them and/or do things to attract them

----End Quote

I'll both agree, but offer a disagreement to both. I agree that both of the above are important - and flexibility I have always thought was the greatest assest a technology company can have.

However, on point 1 - those options are there on a lot of the platforms, and growing in their complexity and flexibility. What I see more often than not, is that advertisers are not in the position to take advantage of many of the tech tools that are available from networks. For example, let us take PPC-keyword (non-brand) traffic vs. Coupon traffic.

Assume that an advertiser wants to pay differently for those two types of traffic. The network can do that in most cases - but can the merchant/advertiser? In order to do so, they would need to be able to supress coupon codes on incoming PPC traffic... otherwise, the PPC affiliate isn't going to play the game. Is the advertiser flexible enough within their own organization to do that... and, are they powerful enough in their brand to be able to stay on the high-powered coupon sites while offering a lower commission. These aren't just easy-to-solve tech problems for a merchant, but often philosophical discussions that need to go through levels of management, etc...

What I am saying is... is it really the "technology" at the network level that is holding the merchant back here?


2) I actually just flat out disagree with this. Even if advertisers do have to go out and recruit their own partners (this is a bad thing?) - the relationship is often made much easier by the things an Affiliate Network has in place, and how they do business. Top coupon affiliates often only work with established networks because they have gotten used to how the datafeed and data-driven tools work on a certain network... Top PPC affiliates may only work with certain established networks that they can trust to pay on time to keep the cash flow up, etc...

I know a lot of this based upon our own struggle to gain marketshare over the last 6 years - and how hard we have had to work for the trust level that we have established in order to play with a lot of the top affiliates. It isn't easy, and it is something as a network we can bring to the table in a relationship building process. The people we have worked with over the last 6 years will more quickly work with a merchant because they trust the network platform, and they know how it works... This will be true for all of the networks that you mention because each one of them has been going out for the entire lifecycle of their company and building relationships - not just technology.

Then, take into account the personal relationships that affiliates (top) have with networks... think of it this way, if a top affiliate is important to a merchant - they are going to be 100 times more important to a network. All networks have gone out and gone out of their way to pay close attention to that affiliate - whoever they may be. Does this not help the advertiser that is participating on that network?

I will agree with you that change, innovation, and flexibility are extremely important - and should be things that all service providers in this industry are constantly working towards.... However, I do not believe that traditional "Affiliate Networks" are holding anybody back in this space. I've seen too many success stories and witnessed too many innovative steps that merchants have taken WITHIN the scope of an "Affiliate Network" to believe otherwise.



Regarding JellyFish.com - are you saying that they don't work with the "Big 3" networks, ... ? From looking through their site this doesn't appear to be the case ??

Jeff,

What about the theory that says, "In Affiliate Marketing - the technology matters less to an advertiser than the relationships that are brought to the table."

In other words... can a "Big 3" be displaced simply on the basis of new and innovative technology? Is there a larger "problem" that needs to be solved by a technological advance?

Short of "Finding the new Cookie" - I don't think so. Technology is cool, and it helps... but unless you are simultaneously researching what all of those companies are doing to build relationships and "Human Value" to their platforms, I don't think you are seeing the whole picture on this.

And Sam - why didn't you tell me about your site?! I like - but now I have to play reader catchup. :)

I'm actually suprised at this discussion, and also a little late to the table! However, I will add a very brief point from my perspective. It is my opinion that the line is very clear between the value of an Affiliate Network - and that of a CPA Network. Namely, the affiliates (publishers) are different. Where I think Jeff M. is correct is in his suggestion that CPA Networks can be successfull (sometimes very successful) and have a higher profit margin per action at times. However, I'm not sure that being "successfull", or having a larger margin in certain cases makes them a threat to what is called a "Traditional Affiliate Network".

From what I see, advertisers who have offers that are suitable for a CPA type deal - and who also have multiple SKU rev-share % deals are using a combination of both mediums to attain their goals. It isn't my place here to provide the specific examples that I am thinking of, but they are out there to find. In reality I think they are being used as seperate channels, where appropriate. (Not all merchants can use "CPA", and not all can use "Affiliate")

Jeff, one thing that did sound interesting to me was the willingness to "give up" transparency in exchange for "more sales with less effort". This sounds counter to me to advice that I've heard from you and conversations I've had with AMs on the issue. The majority of AMs that I work with want more vision into the whole process... not less. So, my question is... Is this a "limited" viewpoint that is being voiced by Ms. X - is it really one that is gaining mainstream and grand scope amongst advertisers (that of desiring less work/more sales/less transparency) ... I don't doubt that Ms. X is sincere, and I can certainly understand the viewpoint - but I'm not sure that it is gaining as much traction as is being suggested here.

Sorry I'm late to the party, feel free to ignore me. :)

Congratulations Scott, I missed this announcement until now with recent travels, but all the best to your family!

-Brian