DISQUS

OH DAMMIT THIS ISN'T THE IM WINDOW

-- Pauley

Been there, done that.

-- Pauley

No idea, but did you know that Frank Oz was born there?

-- Pauley

Here here. The impression I got from reading what happened at the end of the previous conflict was that the Israeli prime minister blinked first. The Israeli military was ready and willing to keep going, but Olmert balked under international pressure.

Meanwhile, as Israel reloads, Hezbollah's stockpiling rockets, too. From the same article:

Hezbollah is armed with thousands of rockets and Nasrallah has said his arsenal survived the Israeli onslaught. He boasted in a TV interview last week that the guerrillas — and their weapons — were still at the Israeli border in south Lebanon.

I'm all behind Israel on this one, 'cause I believe they've got the moral upper hand.

Indeed. Alternatively, your partner can get you your very own dime-in ring, too. ;)

(All kidding aside, I see right where you're coming from.)

-- Pauley

I have yet to see any solid evidence that he even had capable armaments. The only evidence of WMDs were spent mustard gas shells from the first gulf war.

The Interim Progress Report of October 2003 (issued after the invasion) had already indicated dozens of WMD-related activities and equipment related to them had been hidden from UN weapons inspectors. Former Iraqi Survey Group head David Kay testified before the US Senate in January 2004 that Saddam had a missile program capable of delivering WMDs as warheads, and was intent on restarting a nuclear weapons program, in defiance of UN resolutions.

Then why is Iraq so special? What about the Massacre in Sudan, Mugabe, Kim Jon Il, the unstable situation among the various ’stans, and the continued presence of the Taliban in Afghanistan? ALl those seem to be as important, or more important, than Iraq pre-invasion.

Iraq was invaded because it posed an imminent threat, and had verifiable links to al Qaeda and Osama bin Laden. And no, as I stated above, I'm not of the belief that Saddam was behind 9/11. He did, though, have have contacts and links to bin Laden and other senior members of al Qaeda.

The other countries you mentioned have not justified military action at this time, though diplomatic efforts are underway by a number of parties (not just the United States) in most of those theaters.

That's a poor dogde that fails to actually address the outright failure of the U.S.'s commitment to capture Bin Laden and properly liberate Afghanistan. It's clear to anyone that the U.S. has bungled in Afghanistan and has failed to properly supply coalition forces in the region to ensure that the Taliban were properly dealt with, and now those volunteer forces are stuck there for many more years, and are experiencing many more deaths than they should have. How can IRAQ be more important than the elimination of the forces that shielded the main perpetrator of 9-11? Is that nota greater goal in the war on terror? Saddam has a history of atrocities, but he was no immediate threat to the U.S., whereas there are many regimes that were, and still are, a major threat.

Saddam was indeed a threat. He had technology, knowledge, and funding to provide support to al Qaeda, as well as an intent to resume development of weapons of mass destruction.

It's impossible to know for a fact in advance how long an operation, especially one as large as the one in Afghanistan, is going to take. Like I said, battle is fluid, and things are constantly changing, and things take time. FDR in 1941 didn't propose a timetable to win WWII -- he simply proposed winning it.

Like I said before, I can't speak to specific highlights or shortcomings of the US strategy and battle plans in Afghanistan. People with access to more intelligence (as in information, not as in brainpower) than I can better determine the proper course of action. My impression, however, of our current military leaders does not lend them to a position wanting to see their operations fail, and I don't think they're going to just let Afghanistan crumble if there's something they can do about it.

Truth is, I haven't heard a lot about Afghanistan lately. Iraq is evidently a juicier news story.

-- Pauley

Yes, and we already had a Gulf War in the early 90’s as a result. That is hardly justification for a post 9/11 conflict.

Yes. A Gulf War that was ended in part because Saddam agreed to give up his WMD programs and prove to the UN he had done so. He had over a decade to comply, and he failed to do so.

This was his attempt to keep the religious regimes off his back, but is harly any worse than the dozens of regimes in the ’stans nad Africa that do much of the same.

I fail to see any justification for supporting those who deliberately murder unarmed civilians.

the U.S. undermanned Afghanistan, and is forcing the limited resources of nations like Denmark and Canada to stabilize a region the U.S. should be focusing on.

No one is being forced to do anything. The United States isn't working alone in Afghanistan; many countries joined the coalition in an attempt to stop al Qaeda voluntarily. As far as undermanning... battle plans are fluid. They have to be, because it's impossible to absolutely know ahead of time what your enemy is going to do. If the Defense Department determines that the changing situation requires more troops there, then I would agree, more should be deployed. I'm not a military strategist, though, and I'll leave those decisions to those with more knowledge of how to run a war.

-- Pauley

Show me the name.

I want to see the name of someone who's been thrown in prison unjustly because of the USA PATRIOT Act.

-- Pauley

The invasion of Iraq was very much an attack on terror. Saddam's regime murdered anywhere from (depending where you check your numbers) 300,000 to 1,000,000 of his own citizens. He used poison gas both on Iranian soldiers during the Iran-Iraq War, and on unarmed Iraqi Kurds.

Saddam supported and sponsored terrorism, compensating families of Palestinian suicide bombers up to $25,000 when the bombers murdered Israeli civilians on buses and in restaurants, and sheltering members of Abu Nidal and the Palestine Liberation Front -- the group headed by Abu Abbas, who led the group that hijacked the Achille Lauro in 1985, and killed a US citizen in a wheelchair.

The US hasn't abandoned the mission in Afghanistan. A large multi-national force is still in the region, working to track down and either capture or kill bin Laden. I think it's an advantage that we can task our military to perform two different operations simultaneously.

-- Pauley

The bulk of the ones that are blowing up US troops aren't Iraqi nationals, they're foreign fighters, allied with or members themselves of al Qaeda.

No, I don't believe that was the entire reason the US invaded Iraq, but it was a nice side effect. The primary reason for the invasion was to eliminate a threat of weapons of mass destruction, which Saddam's regime was known to have.

Weapons of mass destruction held by Saddam's government don't necessarily take the form of completed weapons. The knowledge of how to create such weapons isn't something that can be simply confiscated. Say we'd just taken all the weapons away and left them be. They still know how to make them, and just need to acquire more resources -- bam, fresh nuclear/biological/chemical weapons ready to point at Israel, or North America, or to sell to someone else more willing to destroy us.

We invaded Iraq to stop the threat of use and/or proliferation of weapons that could be used to attack us, and wound up with a newly liberated democratic nation. Tajikistan, Zimbabwe and Sudan don't pose military threats to the United States. I wouldn't be surprised to see, however, oppressed peoples like those of the countries you mentioned rise up against their leaders once Iraq starts to operate on its own, and demonstrate how much better a democratic system works.

-- Pauley

The United States isn't trying to subjugate the Iraqi people. America has a successful record of nation-building (Germany, Japan, Panama...), and we never tried to make those countries colonies or the 51st state.

-- Pauley

No, I do not believe Iraq was directly responsible for 9-11.

I do believe that Hussein had connections to al Qaeda, and was in the process of gaining resources to manufacture weapons of mass destruction. I do believe that more Iraqi citizens were being killed by Hussein's government in a month/week/insert-time-period-here than are dying now as a result of terrorist actions. I do believe that even if Saddam's regime had no physical WMDs in stock, they had the technical know-how to make them, or provide info to terrorist groups on how to make them.

I believe that 26 million Iraqi citizens are now liberated from the oppression of a tyrant. And I believe that was a goal worth fighting for.

-- Pauley

If I had to choose a dictatorship to live under...

Me, I'd just as soon stay here in the States, and not live under a dictatorship at all.

-- Pauley

IMG tags aren't permitted in comments. Links are, so you can link to the picture if you like.

-- Pauley

We did go, though the camera stayed in the car. No one stopped me from taking it, just kinda left it behind.

I'd been before, Yvonne hadn't. 'twas fun times, and Yvonne wants to go back to have more time to look around the glass market. :)

-- Pauley

*snerk*

-- Pauley :-D

Alex's post is open, so I'll link to where I used it.

-- Pauley

'sup D-Funk?

I used to use Brian's Threaded Comments, but had some difficulty (probably due to my own ineptness) making it work with the new theme. Currently running here is TinyThread.

-- Pauley

Tempting, but against my better judgement, I'll keep you around for now.

-- Pauley

...aaaand Andy's brain a-splodes with unneeded visuals. :)

-- Pauley

Oh, it sounds like we got serviced alright, Dave -- of the bend-over-and-take-it variety of "being serviced."

-- Pauley

I think Mexico's government should help Mexico develop their economy, instead of distributing pamphlets and information explaining how to sneak across the US border.

I like your analogy, but it doesn't quite work right... I have no problem figuring out why the roof is leaking, and patching the hole (securing the border) so rain can't get in. But what you seem to be suggesting would be the equivilent of trying to figure out why it's raining.

-- Pauley

"Son, I have no problem going back to prison."

-- Pauley

Stuck at the dry cleaner.

-- Pauley

freekofnature wrote:

BTW, I have added you (Pauley) to my friends list.

BTW back to you -- click here to add a feed of this blog here to your LJ friends list, with links to the entries here -- saves you from having to go look to see if I've posted. :)

-- Pauley