DISQUS

I prefer seeing the size of the document.

Angle brackets got chewed above - should read:

As SEOs we know that every restaurant in downtown (insert any big city here) would not rank in the top 30 results

Ash Nallawalla's last blog post..Looking for local results?

> reveals just why it’s so hard to get small businesses to break their local newspaper/yellow pages advertising habit.

The cited article does not say that. It says

> In other words, while small business people use search engines for nearly every bit of research they do they must think they are the only ones doing it since they don’t work to make their business more visible to searchers. I don’t get that intellectually but I know it’s real. Here are some highlights.
> * 82% of these small business folks use search engines
> * 57% use Yellow Page directories (this one surprised me)

It talks about using YPs to do their research, not their advertising.

As an SEO at one of the few successful YPs that are still in growth mode (Australia), I have a bias but I can understand the romantic notion that "surely everybody uses the web", therefore every business should have a website.

As SEOs we know that every restaurant in downtown would not rank in the top 30 results in Google simply because there are more than 30 restaurants downtown, but every restaurant does have the chance of a free listing in their local YP. A paid YP listing gives them more space and a better chance to rank in the corresponding IYP.

We also know that many restaurant sites are built badly and will not rank short of a redesign. The last 44% of business owners will include ones who will not have the budget to have an optimised site. They'll not be happy if they cut their YP spend and their new website gets no traffic.

Some IYPs have managed to optimise their content and so their advertisers (and free listings) get another chance to rank high in Google. In Oz a few adult categories are lawful and can advertise in the YP/IYP -- their individual websites have the usual challenge of ranking in a competitive category, but the IYP list of their category ranks in the top 5 thanks to SEO of a large, trusted site.

Some IYPs have cut deals with Google so that the onebox (aka ten pack) is powered partly with their listings, which gives another opportunity to appear at the top of page 1.

Therefore, it isn't an either/or situation.

It won't make you feel better, but I paid the same price for being 0.8 seconds late at the lights leading into Tulla airport.

[quote]you can’t track how people use the yellow pages, you can’t see which people read your ad, or how many times people read it and took action, or no action. There is no data to support their continued use.[/quote]

You should look up Dennis Fromholzer's metered ads studies. http://www.crmassoc.com/documents/CRM20050505/C...

The printed books are handy away from the computer room, e.g. we're in the kitchen and decide to eat out, or we're in the car and want to find restaurants in an unfamiliar suburb. Not everyone leaves their PC switched on.

Even in a web browser an IYP site is better than a Google search because a search result doesn't tell me if I have looked at all the available resuts for a given area. You just see the ones who used SEO or you see many results that aren't business listings but might rank for the search query, e.g. they are reviews. The printed book (or IYP) lists every business in a given heading - some IYPs also have ratings and reviews, which can help narrow down a choice.

You need to link to the current URL

That "excellent article" link no longer works. I beg to differ about the comment that "there is no certain way for a real estate company to calculate return on investment when it comes to traditional pay per click advertising, since the actual transaction does not take place on the website".

If the landing page for the ad collects the identity of the lead, e.g. download a useful PDF, the subsequent transaction can be linked to the source. Make the landing page memorable in some way and a buyer will remember that they came via a PPC ad. If needs be, buy a special 800 number that is only used on the landing page and track its usage.

I have only managed to get listed once out of perhaps 10 site submissions (not all owned by me) so I don't bother. Rather than sling mud at the ODP, let's wait for Google to unveil its own directory - its hiring in the Local and Classifieds arena suggests that something is brewing there.

Mike, Well done, once again - hope to see you again at Pubcon this December.

I generally agree with the thrust of the article but not all points. I agree that a large number of SEOs clearly are not at the cutting edge and don't know it. Perhaps they only work in noncompetitive niches and have had a good run with the old tactics.

I don't perform SEO anymore but teach the subject professionally and SEO my own sites, having worked on nearly 2000 sites belonging to others. Cold-calling is sometimes necessary and real businesses are not surprised to get a sales call - many of them also do it from time to time. Luckily, my last employer had a large subscriber base, so we didn't need to cold call often.

My salespeople were careful not to "teach SEO" to prospects who kept asking detailed questions. e.g. It is fine to ask about links, but asking how many links and from which specific sites is asking too much before the sale.

There is a small niche that wants to learn and they like calling every SEO they can find to see if there is a pattern they can discern. While there is little risk of them really learning everything, they waste time if they don't want to pay for SEO.

I have one from 3 Australia (sand) bought on 25 June. It has product code 0547466 and its languages are English, Indonesian, Pilipino (that's the spelling they used, not Tagalog).

It took me a lot of searching to find out where to find the product code. It is on the white sticker behind the battery.

It won't take the 12 firmware as 3 has not yet approved it.

Mahesh,
Just heard the great news - well done, and it was almost yesterday when you said you were starting this new company called Pinstorm...