DISQUS

Wow. This thought just floored me. Small church. Intense period of discipleship. Then "go and do likewise."

Maybe that Jesus guy had it right all along.

Thanks for this, brother.

Grace and Peace,
Raffi

This Sunday was unusually special for me. I was asked to speak to our members and guests at our annual Thanksgiving dinner. I felt proud and humbled. I felt fear and trembling. I felt a sense of responsibility and a sense of utter unworthiness. In other words, I felt human.

I've posted the audio of my little Thanksgiving message, for anyone who might be interested.

Thanks for the ongoing discussion of this question, Jonathan. I think it's brilliant.

Grace and Peace,
Raffi

Pretty karmic, Jonathan.

I just finished up my post for today over at Parables, then went over to my feed reader and clicked on Missio...wow, wierd. Anyway, I guess my answer to your question (before I even read the question) "How much comes from group think" would be this: A lot, lot, lot more than we often realize.

Grace and Peace...and get outta my head, will ya!

Raffi

Hey, Jonathan.

I was hoping to see you at the Wright/Ehrman debate last night. It was such a full house that I might've missed you. If you missed it, and anyone else who might have, I have the full audio of the evening up at my site.

Truly a night to remember.

Grace and Peace,
Raffi

Speaking of Palin, I've just posted a never-before-seen Sarah Palin baby video, for anyone who might be interested. It's quite telling.

Grace and Peace,
Raffi

Jonathan:

I was wondering if you were aware of (or would be attending) the N.T. Wright / Bart Ehrman dialogue in October. I'm planning to come up with my pastor. Would love to see you there as well.

Keep me posted.

Grace and Peace,
Raffi

I thought someone might enjoy my take on the subject.

Grace and Peace,
Raffi Shahinian

You guys have all seen The Story of Stuff, right? If not, it's an absolute must. Trust me, take the 15-or-so minutes to go through it. Then pass it on.

Grace and Peace,
Raffi

Thanks, Daniel. Glad you enjoy my stuff. I've got Jonathan on my blogroll, but he's never returned the favor (wink wink).

Jonathan. You gotta be reading Michael Spencer's stuff, right?! (iMonk and Jesus Shaped Spirituality).

Grace and Peace,
Raffi

Theology is a bridge. Relationship (both vertical and horizontal--thanks Laura) is where the bridge takes you.

More on bridges here.

Grace and Peace,
Raffi

Beautiful piece, brother. I've also posted something today about the Bentley issue and the dangers involved, but more from a worldview-level perspective. Thought you might be interested.

Grace and Peace,
Raffi Shahinian
Parables of a Prodigal World

Hey Jonathan:

Courage, yes. It's got that theme. But courage unto what? Personal glory? Individual (or team) victory? And the quote to start, "Everything you need is already inside." Is it really? Are we talking about the divine spark of gnosticism?

Look, you know I'm not the one to say that everything "of the world" is evil. But big businesses like Nike are really, really good at tapping into that genuine place in all of us that wants to scream "Hooray!," and parodying the truth by just a nudge to accomplish their purpose (buy Nike products). Someone once said that 99% of what the devil tells us is true.

Just some thoughts from the top of my head, brother.

By the way, I dug the commercial too.

Grace and Peace,
Raffi

Nice review. I'm also one of the Nelson reviewers, though I opted to do a series, as I see you might as well. Thought you might be interested.

Grace and Peace,
Raffi Shahinian
Parables of a Prodigal World

Let's look at it another way: What if only God is perfect? What if Jesus is the truth? What if Scripture is both perfect and true only in the limited sense of being the true and perfect witness of the God revealed in and through Jesus?

By the way, Jonathan, kudos for that awesome post over at Emergent Village. Everyone check it out, if you haven't already.

Grace and Peace,
Raffi

I remember hearing an N.T. Wright lecture where he said something like the following:

"I remember being phoned by a reporter one time and being asked what I thought about the blasphemy laws and whether I would like to see them abolished. And without really thinking about it (I must have been saying my prayers, or someone was praying for me) I heard myself say: 'The Jesus that I worship allowed himself to be mocked, beaten, and spat upon, and when one of His followers tried to defend Him, He said "We don't do things that way." And that is precisely the story by which the world is saved.'"

I'd defer to the good Bishop on this one.

Grace and Peace.

I remember hearing an N.T. Wright lecture where he said something like the following:


"I remember being phoned by a reporter one time and being asked what I thought about the blasphemy laws and whether I would like to see them abolished. And without really thinking about it (I must have been saying my prayers, or someone was praying for me) I heard myself say: 'The Jesus that I worship allowed himself to be mocked, beaten, and spat upon, and when one of His followers tried to defend Him, He said "We don't do things that way." And that is precisely the story by which the world is saved.'"



I'd defer to the good Bishop on this one.



Grace and Peace.

And what a dialogue its been! Actually, I disagree with Jonathan in that I don't think we disagree. And that's an interesting illustration of what I've been trying to get at.

I agree that we need language and organization to understand Jesus. My specific concern is how we will use that language, what that organization will look like, and, perhaps most importantly, what level of preeminence "language and organization" will take.

Jonathan gave the example, over at Parables, that even Paul had to write letters to explain the role of the Spirit in all this. Well, yes and no. Paul wrote letters because that was the only way to communicate with his brothers and sisters in the varying churches he had planted across the region. And we often forget that Paul was not trying to communicate the truth of the gospel in those letters. He had already done that when he established the churches. He was using the theological components of that truth to deal with very specific issues in very specific churches in a very specific socio-historical setting.

And speaking of Paul's letters, notice where 500 years of bestowing preeminence upon the "language and organization" thereof has led us.

Imagine, over that same time frame, if we, as a body, had sought the truth not in the words of Paul letters but in the person of Jesus, by His methods (parable, symbol, story, riddle, consciously-subversive actions,...). Imagine if we, as a body, had taken seriously His declaration "I am the Truth," and had sought to decipher the mystery contained in that statement. I'd bet top dollar that there would be no need today for anything resembling the emerging conversation.

Like I said, this is huge stuff. Too huge for words. I'm sure some of you have heard the one about the prima ballerina being asked after a performance by a reporter, "What did the dance mean?" She replied, "If I could say it in words, I wouldn't need to dance it."

Anyone feel like dancing?

Grace and Peace,
Raffi

My comment morphed into a post.

Grace and Peace,
Raff

Yeh, Jonathan. Why would you want to be a Samaritan...er...Atheist? Don't you know that Samaritans, I mean Atheists, are bad people?! Bad, bad, bad!!!!

Yes. For most of us (myself included), most of the time, the gospel of Jesus Christ.

U2, "One".

And by the way, you've been tagged.

Grace and Peace,
Raffi

Jonathan,

Bravo. I guess I gotta go back to my favorite extra-biblical quote that kind of sums this all up, the great St. Francis saying to his disciples: "Go and preach the gospel by all means possible; and if it's really necessary, you can even use words."

Grace and Peace,
Raffi

Hi Jonathan:

Great Post. I hope you don't mind but I used the joke as a kind of parable in discussing the whole Barack Obama / James Dobson ruckus.

Grace and Peace,
Raffi

Thanks for this post. I'm a Christian and a life-long Carlin fan as well, and I did my own little tribute to the man, from a similar-but-different perspective. Thought you might be interested.

Grace and Peace,
Raffi Shahinian
Parables of a Prodigal World

A note to all N.T. Wright fans. Big T.V. appearance tonight, 11:30 ET / 10:30 CT.

Should be interesting. Thought you might wanna know.

Grace and Peace,
Raffi Shahinian
Parables of a Prodigal World