Read the Sermon on the Mount (Matthew chapters 5-7) and then tell me where are these teachings from .. God? or man?

Well they certainly don't come from the god of the Old Testament. That dude was a hateful terrorist.

He'd be known to drown an ant colony or two.

And let's not even get started on Onan.

Jesus is the God of the Old Testament.

Luckily, in the new testament he remembered to take his meds.

So he was disobeying his own laws?

Ah so it was Jesus who commanded the prophet, Joshua, to enter Jericho and kill everyone? That means pre-mortal Jesus asked his followers to kill men, women, children, babies, the handicapped, the elderly, with all their pets and livestock too. Thanks Jesus.

It takes hubris to claim without argumentation or citation that "Jesus is the historical myth" when the article you are commenting about notes that most Biblical scholars, including agnostics, recognize Jesus as an historical figure.

I made no claim about the historicity of Jesus or anything else historical. I commented on your continued propensity to make pronouncements and insults rather than offer argumentation. Why do you believe that Jesus is a myth?

Baloney.

“‘Now this was the sin of your sister Sodom: She and her daughters were arrogant, overfed and unconcerned; they did not help the poor and needy. They were haughty and did detestable things before me. Therefore I did away with them as you have seen."
Ezekiel 16:49-50

Theres a difference between a proud terrorist usurping power not his own to destroy what is not his for carnal gain and a Judge justly acting within His power to protect what is His...

If any consistent theme emerges from the OT its this:

"God opposes the proud but gives grace to the humble." (Proverbs, Isaiah, James, Peter)

When you use your Bible to try to convince non-believers, I have to wonder seriously about your intelligence.

Confused as to how referencing the source material in question instead of emoting is unintelligent? My agnosticism was muted by vetting the Bible myself instead of trusting the regurgitated rhetoric from behind the podium, pulpit and computer screen. Only thing I'm trying to provide is another perspective. Internet fingerprints tend to have a permanency and if it makes one stray reader want to vivisect the text then great. Let everyone be convinced one way or another in their own minds. Peace

Ironic. Making an absolute truth claim about God while looking down on those who make absolute truth claims about God? #Hubris

Considering human beings are known for overactive imaginations and creating wondrous and in depth mythologies, I'm going to go with man. There's also the slightly sticky wicket of the bible being translated so many times, and through so many languages that it's probably a less than accurate account. There is also the problem of everyone depicting Jesus and his followers as white surfer dudes. Can you really claim historical accuracy and turn a blind eye to inaccuracies?

Overactive imaginations do not make up such timeless and priceless teachings. If you find time to read the Bible .. it's easy to see it is from a divine source. If you listen to what people tell you about the Bible .. you are listening to a man.

As far as historical accuracy ... consider the vast number of cities, kingdoms, kings/rulers mentioned in the Bible. It's all backed up by archeological findings. Descriptions of countries such as Egypt are accurately depicted in the Bible (i.e. the Nile River and crops and sheperding lifestyle). Other secular sources have written about Jesus, even though they opposed his teachings. Wars that were fought ... again accurately depicted in the Bible when compared to archeological evidence.

As opposed to the BOM which has zero archaeological evidence.

Right!

The Book of Mormon is also true.

You tell 'em, Bobby!

And don't let all the facts get in the way of that faith! Believe! Believe with everything you've got!

Lord of the Rings. Contains languages that can be written and spoken, like Elvish.

Book Mormon. Even wingdings can be read in real life

Don't forget Klingon.

But how does any of that prove that the bible is the literal word of some god? The archeological findings may very well prove that the writers of the history were accurate in their place descriptions, but little else.

That is just a portion of the evidence of being the Word of God. This is substantial because at times Bible accounts were questioned because of lack of archeological evidence. However, archeological findings over the last 300 + years have supported the Bible's accuracy ... stumping the nay-sayers.

Other evidence is the fact that the Bible was far ahead of its time scientifically. The Bible recorded that the earth is a sphere ... long before man discovered it was so. The Bible told of countless numbers of stars in the sky ... yet before telescopes scientists charted out only hundreds (believing it to be so). There are other scientific facts like this as well.

Another portion is the teaching. Most agree that if people followed the teachings in the Bible ... the world would be a much better/safer place. The teachings are practical and benificial today and forever. Where could such wisdom come from?

Genocide of those who don't share our beliefs would make the world better and safer? Well then, we should be seeing world peace any day now.

This is pretty much bull.

We now know the Hebrews were never slaves in Egypt. We know the Exodus never happened. We know Jericho wasn't a walled city at the time those walls are said to have come down. We know the Hebrews never invaded the Holy Land, but are the descendants of the native people, i.e. the Hebrews never conquered the Canaanites they ARE the Canaanites.

This "archeology proves the Bible" is carp. Pure, carp.

Wow! I have heard some harsh criticism of the Judeo/Christen/Muslim Old Testament, but I've never heard anyone refer to it as a trash fish; i. e., carp! I suggest that your theories about the Exodus and who the Hebrews truly were is likely closer to trash than the Old Testament. No, it is not the literal word of God; too many translations from too many different authors, plus too many editorial sessions, like the Coucil of Nicea, to believe that. But there is no mistaking the Divine content of the messages, largely consistent across centuries and known geography.

So which do you prefer? The Torah, The Quran, or The Bible? The Hebrews were Semite desert dwellers to answer your question. Vicious ones if the OT is to be believed...as was their god.

"Divine content"? How is this unmistakeable in the bible? That's balderdash. Give me some evidence beyond the feeling you get when you read certain passages.

You wish to believe and you do. That's where "testimonies" ALL come from. Someone (mom, dad, mishy, whatever) told you they believe and induced you to do so. That's the unending story of religion. I'm sure you've read and pondered and prayed...and I'm happy for you to follow your feelings and live your life with your testimony. Not too convincing for me though.

No, not divine literal content. That idea is, at best, poorly informed. The florid English in the King James Version, compared to the Douai or the Hebrew versions, is silly, designed to attract literate English language users, who at the time were largely clergy or well off. What is much more convincing are the personal and social constructs that arose. They also reflect Einsteins famous axiom: "God doesn't play dice." Random occurrence does offer a plausible explanation, but it does not explain the amazing symmetry in the universe(s). Give people credit. Don't underestimate them. Billions of people over thousands of years have reached the conclusion that there is something beyond human intelligence, something greater. You are entitled to have your own convictions, but judging other people's convictions is nihilistic, beneath human capability.

Amazing symmetry can be attributed to billions of years of physical laws, gravity, etc.
Humans also believe in many mythical creatures. Belief in myth doesn't indicate those myths are true. Every generation of humans have proven to be illogical and ignorant.
If there is one constant, it is the humans have the capacity to fool themselves, many, many times over the course of their lifetimes.
I, for one, am glad humans have moved on past they behaviors illustrated in the Old Testament.

Believe in a talking donkey? A god who has children eaten by bears for laughing at Elijah's bald head?

This is a great documentary explaining how humans fool themselves:

https://www.youtube.com/wat...

I do not believe the bible is anything more than interesting stories. If I told you a story about my childhood, whoever was in my story with me, might disagree with my interpretation of what I think are the facts. All life is a story. Since we believe we are here, I guess it behooves us to treat each other with respect. From my perspective anyone brave enough to come into this realm is pretty darned awesome. As an Idaho American I've lived a fairly sheltered life compared to a lot of others in this place we call earth. I am fascinated though by people like Einstein, Shakespeare, Poets, scientists and all the really driven people who seem to be on a quest, to invent or shake stuff up. People born with the innate ability to play the piano. Virtuoso's practically at birth. Unexplainable. I'm okay with not knowing. Might as well be okay with it, since there is no explanation unless you want to make something up. We as a people do that pretty well.

That does make sense. Some of the tales in the bible resemble other tales from different cultures at the time. The tales were no doubt carried by travelers wherever they went.

Did I say literal? Literal schmiteral. I do not find one god Semite literature, nor it's originated religions, to be either spiritually uplifting, mentally comforting, or intellectually satisfying. I find some of the Eastern wisdom philosophies, i.e. religions, to carry a far preferable message. I find The Bhagavad Gita to be far more informing and insightful than anything Semite literature might offer, as an example.

I share in your awe of the universe, and of our very being. It would be cool to know precisely and exactly by name and personality the person who put it all in motion. Except...no it wouldn't. That's the easy way out. I prefer to eat my desert last, and roll my life out similarly. I do the hard stuff first. That's how I learned about scriptures. I read them. I studied them. Lots of them. Lots of times.

Einstein did not believe in a personal god.

Einstein used "god" either in a deist way -- a creator god who doesn't get involved after that -- or as a euphemism for nature.

Who cares what Einstein believed?

Bobby, that is so funny, I almost gave you an upvote!

You are right because Einstein had holes in his socks .

Yes it's where the feet went in.

Who cares what you believe.

You people are unbelievable. Einstein was not inspired.

That was not and is not an axiom. Do you even know what an axiom is? Einstein's comment is not a part of any theory.

I must admit I get most of my information from popular science sources: National Geographic, Smithsonian Magazine, Discover and now those and similar websites. Basically, recent research distilled for laymen.

You on the other hand seem to be getting all your information from apologists.

If you'd like a gentle introduction to what we actually know about ancient Israel, Wikipedia is as good a place to start as any. There are plenty of footnotes, linked articles and resources to start a good overview of the subject.

History of ancient Israel and Judah
http://en.wikipedia.org/wik...

Be warned that this information comes from actual science, not people just making stuff up -- so it may be unfamiliar to you. Take it slow, a section at a time and you'll be fine.

For example:

"modern studies have revealed that the Israelites emerged from a dramatic social transformation of Canaanite nomads of the central hill country of Canaan around 1200 BCE, with no signs of violent invasion or even of peaceful infiltration of a clearly defined ethnic group from elsewhere."

Good luck.

It's too bad Harry Potter wasn't written 2000 years ago... We would have way more entertaining conversations with you people. But all the geography of the UK is consistent!! Poor non-believers.. Voldemort has a hold of your souls...

Too bad none of these apologetics are actually true. Of course the exodus being a complete myth, giant people, dragons, and a global flood fable don't really add to any biblical credibility.

Don't forget about the unicorns. Yes..the unicorns :)