Disqus - Friends of Butch1

Re: It’s over

Ritorna Vincitor — Fri, 09 May 2008 15:35:57 -0000

Re: John McCain’s problem with women

Ritorna Vincitor — Sun, 18 May 2008 14:33:51 -0000

Bye

Re: John McCain’s problem with women

Ritorna Vincitor — Mon, 19 May 2008 16:57:27 -0000

Re: Hillary supporting congressman says campaign offered racist strategy

Ritorna Vincitor — Sat, 07 Jun 2008 10:29:42 -0000

Oh well.

Re: Hillary on CNN: Obama three for three

Ritorna Vincitor — Thu, 16 Oct 2008 15:19:23 -0000

Hillary is a real class act. And I applaud AmericaBlog for showing their appreciation of this remarkable woman. It's a far cry from the ugly attacks against her posted on this blog day after day, month after month during the primaries. I'm glad to see AmericaBlog can show some appreciation of Hillary, at least when she's saying good things about Obama.

Re: Joe the Plumber owes back taxes

Ritorna Vincitor — Thu, 16 Oct 2008 15:32:33 -0000

I can't believe that "Joe the plumber" described Obama's performance at last night's debate as "a tap dance...almost as good as Sammy Davis, Jr." But according to Ben Smith at Politico, that is what Joe said. What an overtly racist statement!

Re: McCain talks about "Joe the Bomber"

Ritorna Vincitor — Mon, 03 Nov 2008 18:43:52 -0000

A bit of a Freudian slip, since the whole "Joe the Plumber" thing bombed so badly. Joe the Bomber is more accurate. Or perhaps Joe the Bummer.

Re: Disturbed, Desperate Republicans filed FEC complaint against Obama today for visiting his dying grandmother

Ritorna Vincitor — Mon, 03 Nov 2008 18:49:07 -0000

"Any political attack is acceptable." Sure is! And we've certainly seen a lot of despicable attacks. Some of them against Hillary Clinton.... right here on this very blog, if I remember correctly. And I do remember correctly. But hey, we're past all that now, I guess. Onward and upward!

Re: It's official. Nearly 20,000 marriages of gay couples were repealed last night. And their children made bastards.

Ritorna Vincitor — Wed, 05 Nov 2008 14:05:07 -0000

In 1948 the California Supreme Court made California the first state to strike down laws that prevented mixed race couples from marrying. At the time it was an extremely unpopular ruling. At that time, had any church groups decided to put a constitutional amendment on the California ballot to enshrine racial bigotry in the constitution, it would have passed by a landslide. The California constitution would have been amended to specifically exclude couples of mixed race from the right of marriage. But that did not happen.

Yesterday California made history again. It became the first state to put perfectly legal marriages to a popular vote. As a result those marriages - approximately 20,000 in number - have been nullified, and the right for gay couples to marry has been revoked. Some of the backers of the anti-gay ballot measure now vow to go after domestic partnerships in an effort to remove any and all legal protections from gay couples.

My joy at last night's historic triumph over racial bigotry is tempered by the knowledge that many of those who voted for Barack Obama also voted to overturn my marriage because I am gay. One expects that the victims of prejudice would be the first to recognize it when it is directed at someone else, but clearly that is not the case. That is a great shame.

For those who sought to roll back the tide of change, the battle has been won. But I assure you, the war is not over. Case in point, the first lawsuit against this unjust constitutional amendment is being filed today in court by the very couple who won us the right to marry earlier this year. If the people will not support our basic rights, we will turn again to the courts for justice.

Re: More on the anti Prop 8 lawsuits

Ritorna Vincitor — Thu, 06 Nov 2008 13:27:35 -0000

I'm so relieved that my fellow San Franciscans strongly rejected the local ballot measure Proposition R that would have changed the name of a local sewage treatment facility to the George W. Bush Sewage Plant. It would have been such a shameful and undignified thing to do. I'm glad we decided to do the right thing and not give sewage a bad name.

Re: On homophobia and racism

Ritorna Vincitor — Thu, 06 Nov 2008 14:55:06 -0000

Most of us assume that any group that has been victimized by bigotry would automatically be the last group to be bigoted. That is never true, and it is certainly not true in this case. Though it is certainly not true of all African Americans, the black community as a whole has always shown an enormous prejudice against gay people, and has always resented any comparison between the prejudice blacks experienced and the prejudice that gay people experience.

On Tuesday, more educated blacks voted against Proposition 8, while less educated blacks (unfortunately the majority) voted overwhelmingly to strip gays of their right to marry. Many did so at the urging of their pastors.

But I believe the most important factor in the overwhelming support for the anti-gay Proposition among the black community was the issue of societal status. Whether we realize it or not, we all rank ourselves and others according to status in society. And those at the lower end are the first to jealously guard their status. When you get right down to people's basic motivations, no one wants to be at the bottom. And this election provided the perfect opportunity for African Americans to raise their social status as a group. Unfortunately at the same time it also gave them the opportunity to push gay people down a notch or two by officially declaring them unworthy of the status of matrimony. As one radio commentator said, "Gay is the new black." I think this psychological motivation played a huge part in the African American vote on Tuesday, and thus sadly tarnished Obama's victory. Gay people flooded the streets in San Francisco to celebrate the election of Obama, but the celebration quickly ended with the news that our right to marry had just been revoked. The Christian Coalition is greatly encouraged by Tuesday's vote in California, and has said that they will now attempt to ensure that every State constitution is amended to deny gays the right to marry. Our society has a lot of healing to do, and that includes treating gay people with the respect and dignity they deserve. Perhaps President Obama will support equality for all citizens.

Re: On homophobia and racism

Ritorna Vincitor — Thu, 06 Nov 2008 16:10:48 -0000

"Why are blacks being scapegoated for this?" It's just the way the cookie crumbles. Look back just four years. Who got the blame for the disastrous Bush reelection? Gays. Gays were blamed because the issue of gay marriage was said to have brought out the Christian vote for Bush. Even some prominent black leaders and ministers shared this view publicly. Did the Christians get blamed for being so stupid as to allow their bigotry to cause them to reelect a man and a Party we all knew were a disaster? No, despite the war and the non-existent WMD's, etc.ete.etc.. the Christians were not blamed for their stupidity. Did John Kerry's lackluster performance in the debates get blamed? No. Did the ugly lies spread by the GOP Swiftboaters get blamed? No. Did his poor campaign get blamed? No. The talk at the time was that the issue of gay marriage reelected Bush, and Democrats in droves turned on us. People like to scapegoat, and gays are a frequent target, as the black community well knows.

LIke it or not, blacks are now being blamed for enshrining bigotry in California's constitution. Are other groups partially responsible? Of course. But there is no doubt that blacks were the group that far and away gave the most support to Proposition "Hate". The majority of whites and Asians voted against the measure. Latinos were closely divided. But over 70% of blacks voted in favor of denying gay rights - primarily those with the least education. It's a fact. Even the so called "Christian" vote was not as strongly in favor of Prop 8 as the blacks. Had Obama not been on the Democratic ticket ..... Had only the usual number of blacks bothered to vote in this election, Proposition 8 would have been easily defeated instead of winning by a very slim majority. So I'm afraid you're stuck with the blame, or scapegoating, if you wish to call it that. It's just the way the cookie crumbles.

Re: On homophobia and racism

Ritorna Vincitor — Thu, 06 Nov 2008 16:58:18 -0000

As I see it, black support for bigotry is a stain on the black community. I'm so happy Obama won, and so sorry that blacks were the most enthusiastic supporters of Prop "Hate" of any group. It certainly turned my election night joy into an emotional roller coaster ride, as my marriage is one of the ones enthusiastically voted down by the black community for whom I was so happy. Let anyone who has ever had their marriage put to a popular vote, and then overturned be the first to judge me. Nevertheless I remain very happy for the black community and what the election of Mr. Obama means for them, and for us all. I hope he sets a desperately needed example for young blacks of personal responsibility, devotion to family, and reverence for education. And yes, tolerance.

I also firmly believe that Proposition 8 will be defeated in the courts, and eventually gay marriage will be common in every state, just as once forbidden interracial marriage now is. I sincerely hope the black community can learn to rise above their prejudices and join in this important civil rights movement. Otherwise they will be left behind, just as the racial bigots of the old South now find themselves.

I see that you would rather engage in angry replies and personal attacks than deal with the actual issue. I'm not into that kind of thing. I won't be responding again. Feel free to post as you like.

Re: 52% of evangelicals who voted for McCain think Obama is or was a Muslim

Ritorna Vincitor — Tue, 11 Nov 2008 18:12:21 -0000

Sorry, but are Evangelicals known for their reverence for facts? They believe in invisible creatures called angels and demons. They believe that the Earth was created in 7 days. They believe that every species of animal, including dinosaurs, survived a world-wide flood by riding together on a boat. They daily talk with an unseen man who, if he lived at all, died thousands of years ago. If they believe Obama is or was a Muslim, are we surprised? Do we think there is anything we can do to change their minds? Might as well try to tell them that Iraq wasn't behind 9/11. All we can do is vote against them and vote more funds for basic education so that maybe their children will learn to use their brains.

Re: Possibly the most hated man in California today

Ritorna Vincitor — Wed, 12 Nov 2008 01:18:20 -0000

If they don't fire the bum, then they deserve to be boycotted out of existence.

Re: When the LDS came for the homosexuals....

Ritorna Vincitor — Wed, 12 Nov 2008 01:24:47 -0000

My favorite sign carried by a woman at a Prop 8 protest march: "Mormons can have eight wives, and I can't even have one?!"

Let's embarrass the hell out of them. Let's protest in front of their churches. Let's question their tax-exempt status. Let's point out their hypocrisy by dragging up their history of polygamy. Let's point out how they have gone from being the oppressed to being the oppressors. Let their actions have consequences.

Re: Gay marriages start tomorrow in Connecticut

Ritorna Vincitor — Wed, 12 Nov 2008 01:31:22 -0000

I was so proud of California for instituting gay marriage. Now I'm so ashamed. Thank you Mormons. Thank you blacks. Thank you Knights of Columbus. Good lord... the Knights of Columbus. I remember them when I was a kid. All they were good for was putting on ridiculous costumes once a year and accidentally dropping their swords during mass. Oh yes, and hanging around bars. Even my devoutly Catholic mother thought they were a bunch of drunken buffoons.

Re: A Bush voter speaks

Ritorna Vincitor — Wed, 12 Nov 2008 01:37:36 -0000

Someone that stupid should have voted for McCain.

Re: When the LDS came for the homosexuals....

Ritorna Vincitor — Wed, 12 Nov 2008 01:57:44 -0000

You know, the more I think about it, gays were never any kind of threat to traditional marriage. But you know what is? Prop 8. Before Prop 8 the biggest threat to traditional marriage was the shockingly high divorce rate. But now perfectly legal and valid marriages can be invalidated at the ballot box. 18,000 perfectly legal and valid marriages shot down by total strangers in the privacy of the voting booth with impunity and no accountability. Seems to me that's a bigger threat to the institution of marriage than anything anyone could have imagined gays could do. Kind of a bass ackwards way of defending marriage if you ask me. Far from defending marriage, they've demeaned it. By subjecting marriages to the popular vote they've made their "sacred" institution of marriage something arbitrary.

Re: Prop 8 Boycott Called on Legendary El Coyote Restaurant

Ritorna Vincitor — Wed, 12 Nov 2008 14:21:09 -0000

Good. Boycot the restaurant!

I attended a small rally in San Francisco last night and met some very nice people. A larger rally is planned for Saturday.

But I'm still thinking about last Friday's march. I was so proud. It was totally peaceful, and very moving. Thousands of us filled Market Street for many blocks. It took over half an hour for us to pass through the Castro District on our way to Dolores Park. Strangely the news coverage gave wildly different accounts of the crowd numbers. One account mentioned "hundreds", while AP called it "a thousand". The local CBS affiliate news called it 20,000. But the crowd had to be many thousands because it completely filled Dolores Park (several city blocks) and spilled over into the surrounding streets. Perhaps the divergent reports were the result of the crowd starting off small, and picking up more and more marchers and it made its way to the park. It was a very impromptu event, with word originating and spreading on the Internet. Like most, I only found out about it earlier that day.

I'm pleased also that we have protested at St. Mary's Cathedral and the Mormon Temple across the bay in Oakland. If these organizations want to fund hate, let there be repercussions. Let people start questioning their tax exempt status. Let people question their questionable histories, such as sex abuse and polygamy. Let the word "hypocrisy" be carried on placards to their doorsteps. Let them have to think about the public relations damage they will face when they dabble in the lives of those who do not belong to their faith.

Re: Another Bush screw-up may put his last-minute regulations in peril

Ritorna Vincitor — Wed, 12 Nov 2008 14:37:34 -0000

Another Bush failure. A fitting way to end his failed Presidency. He should have stayed out of politics and stuck to ruining oil companies.

Re: Seems you all got Bill Marriott's attention

Ritorna Vincitor — Wed, 12 Nov 2008 14:48:02 -0000

That's right, John. Let's boycott Marriott. He is a major donor to the Mormon church. If he doesn't like it, let him put pressure on his Church to stop using his money to fund hate.

Re: Scott Eckern resigns from California Musical Theatre after protests surrounding his donation to Prop 8

Ritorna Vincitor — Wed, 12 Nov 2008 15:38:09 -0000

This is wonderful news for so many reasons. I'm sure many churchgoers and church leaders are genuinely stunned at the backlash. Almost immediately after the election I began hearing church leaders saying that their churches were being persecuted by gay people. What faulty logic!! Well, let them get used to the backlash. Let it grow. Let there be consequences for trying to force religion on those who don't want it. If the California court does not strike down Prop 8, then there will be a proposition to repeal it in 2010. As they prepare for that fight let them realize what it may cost them.

Re: Scott Eckern resigns from California Musical Theatre after protests surrounding his donation to Prop 8

Ritorna Vincitor — Wed, 12 Nov 2008 16:05:11 -0000

Eckern concluded his letter of resignation by saying, 'I am disappointed that my personal convictions have cost me the opportunity to do what I love the most which is to continue enriching the Sacramento arts and theatre community." Well I'm disappointed too. I'm disappointed that Eckern's personal convictions have put my marriage in jeopardy of being ruled invalid. I'm disappointed that Eckern's personal convictions have cost millions of Californians the right to marry the person they love. I'm disappointed than anyone's basic rights can be invalidated at the ballot box. So Eckern had to resign his job. Boo hoo.

Re: Scott Eckern resigns from California Musical Theatre after protests surrounding his donation to Prop 8

Ritorna Vincitor — Wed, 12 Nov 2008 17:14:39 -0000

I'm so glad the law requires donations to political campaigns to be published. Millions of people voted against the marriages and the marriage rights of others in the privacy and secrecy of the voting booth, and that was perfectly legal. But the names of those who contributed to the campaign against those marriages and those rights are known, and it is perfectly legal for us to go after those people by boycotting their businesses. It is perfectly legal for gay people and their supporters to refuse to patronize the businesses of those who would take away our rights. And I'm glad we're doing it!